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The fact that you can't see such measures as being draconian is kinda the point of this thread. The way that the heavy handed nature of the Australian government approach seems normalized to your average Australian is precisely the normalization of authoritarianism being protested!

You won't see it until you leave that place. The firebombing of Shanks-Markovina should be a wake up call about the power of deeply entrenched corrupt and anti-democratic bodies. The existence of the private criminal investigation into Shanks by interest groups should leave one fearful on the path being followed there.

The Australian economy exists as source of raw materials for the world, a laundromat for wealth via gambling, and a ponzi around housing to enrich the ruling class. Any political force that challenges these pillars is not allowed to be.

You do not understand my position at all. I am denying nothing to anyone. Everyone has the autonomy to choose their own moral and political views, including those which I do not personally approve.

What is not granted is the ability to force another to take on those views. I am not forcing you have have a particular belief structure, but you are making an argument that because a group of people have some pretty crazy ideas we all must be beholden to it. When you want to force an ideology -- and my position is not an ideology, it is an anti-ideology at best.

I posit that forcing women to give birth to babies against their consent is a grave human rights violation and cannot be tolerated in a modern civilized society. It is the same logic of the paradox of tolerance that we cannot permit those to push a their hateful agenda against others, for they will push their ignorance and hate so loud that rights vanish quickly.

I don't hate anyone. I think they are self-defeating and delusional, but I don't hate. Hate is wanting everyone else in the world to believe your delusions, and using the full force of the State to ensure compliance.

There is only one hateful position -- that you have the right to force your beliefs on others bodies. I do not share this position.

Fighting against other people seeking medical procedures is a hateful position. Yes, if you are opposed to another person doing something with their body, you are filled with hate.

Basically you are asking for a tyranny of a majority. It just doesn't matter what you, 1% or 40% or 99% of people believe -- they are free to believe and do whatever they want with their own bodies. They cannot dictate beliefs and behaviors for others. Its just a simple thing. Autonomy.

I think religion has poisoned many minds. Any belief structure that requires forcing a viewpoint onto others is unacceptable.

I do believe all access all the time to whomever wants it, yes. There only one view that matters: A women has the right to decide what happens to her body. Anything else has no place on this planet.

Go oppress someone else.

No. Fuck that. There is not 'two viewpoints'. There is:

* Oppress women * Don't oppress women

This is the paradox of tolerance. You cannot negotiate with a monster who wants to force their views on people, especially those around forced birthing, you know, against the Helsinki Agreement on Human Right among others. There is no benevolent religion or philosophy that requires forcing a person to do something with their body.

I don't have pro or anti views. I just have a single view that you can do whatever you fucking like with your own body, and nobody can tell you that you can or cant. Anything else is fucking monstrous and will not be tolerated.

No, I dont hate them, in fact she is completely within her rights to determine what happens to her own body. What she does not have is the right to say what another woman does with her body. However, if she believes that she can force another woman to give birth because of her own beliefs, she is wrong, and her beliefs are dangerous and wrong.

I feel sorry for the anti-abortion women. I would say they are trapped in a broken world, confused by weird cults (xianity is actually pro-abortion, and the xian bible includes recipes), manipulated by controlling people.

I get it, you hate women and want to punish them for having sex with you. Please reflect on your position.

Your position is horrendously misogynistic, and if you do not understand why, you should talk to some women. Probably don't lead with your sentence as you are likely to get hit in the face.

It would have been nicer to codify the rights before pulling the rug on it.

Yes. Yes. Yes. No.

anything else is none of your business.

I stand by that there is no position that is acceptable to anyone accept their own body. You don't get to decide what other people do.

Yes I do think they hate themselves, or at least hate their sex, their world or their (nonexistent) God. It is intrinsic to the rights of women to do what they want to do with their own body. I accept that a anti-abortion woman does not want to have an abortion herself. I accept that a pro-abortion woman does want an abortion.

Its a complicated issue only to the parties involved. Lets not make it more complicated by taking away autonomy.

I wasn't aware that having a baby was a crime, but yet, failing to birth it appears to be now. nb: Women have gone to jail for miscarriages as a result of such women-hating laws.

My thoughts on the prison system are not relevant to supporting that a women can do whatever she wants with her body.

The earlier part is:

"Boy, I've never seen an issue so divisive. You ever see it, it's like a civil war, isn't it? Even amongst my friends, who are all very intelligent! They are totally divided on abortion! It's unbelievable! Some of my friends, for instance, think these pro-life people are annoying idiots. Other of my friends think these pro-life people are evil fucks. How are we going to come to a consensus? You ought to hear the arguments around my house; "they're annoying, they're idiots, they're evil, they're fucks!" Brothers, sisters, come together! Can't we once just join hands and think of them as evil annoying idiot fucks?" -- Bill Hicks, 1993