constantius

The socialist party hasn't been well-meaning people for a while. I wouldn't even consider them left. Otherwise agree.

> violent rioters use the excuse of the peaceful organized protest to infiltrate and wreak havoc

This is not true, and very much the kind of propaganda spewed by the (far-)right, please do not trust it.

The entire crowd chants very explicit chants against the government and police, gathers around fires in the street, shouts at police when they attack the demonstrators or fire gas canisters and flash-bang grenades. The crowds that get out are not getting smaller, despite mainstream media and government equating the protests with violent looters, so it seems everyone marching feels a need to. There are looters, but they're a tiny, insignificant minority.

The protests are violent because the repression is violent, and because they are marching against real suffering.

Someone sees an opportunity to get some internet points, has zero engagement with the discussion, makes an announcement for a half-baked project: this is how your 2 sentences look. I think your 'initiative' is perfectly illustrating what that community is trying to avoid.

This is getting ridiculous, you've been inventing weird claims this whole discussion and condescendingly arguing against them, and getting personal on top of that. Pathetic.

> I don't care about foreign wars that I have no control over

Talking about a war of invasion by a fascist country on the border of your continent and a genocide. I'm wasting my time.

I think it was a response to 9/11.

> Corbyn? [...] wouldn't stoop as low as persecuting his political opponents. [...] I shouldn't need to comment any further.

Weird misreading of my comment. I'm not saying he would, I'm saying even if someone as fundamentally as him did, I would think less of them, but that I still would understand it.

> Violent crimes are okay when people I politically agree with do it.

Violent resistance to genocide is something I fully support, with absolutely zero qualms about what unfortunate drone, military company, or government official gets hurt in the process. I'd expect everyone would support that, no?

> justifying the sort of behaviour that you claim to oppose (fascism).

Mate... are you serious?

An advice for you: stop supporting Russia and Israel, you could hardly have chosen a worse moral alignment.

Thanks for showing your true colours. Having a discussion in one comment and insulting me in another. Pathetic.

I don't know why you're subtly indicating conspiracy theories here. The support of certain parties, in this case far right ones, by Russia, financially/ideologically/politically, and in the other direction the support of Russia (and the apology of their war of invasion) by these parties is not a secret or a theory, it's not hidden by either Russia or those parties...

And yes, getting support from amd making apologies for a country like Russia is a good signal of who not to want anywhere near the halls of power.

I used to think like you, but living in a country where the far right is about to come to power, and seeing fundamental freedoms disappear by the day, I've understood why people believe that parties like Reform and AFD (and many other parties, who resemble each other as much in their ideology as in their links with Russia, a useful signal) have to be stopped in their tracks while there's a chance, and if we find ourselves in a 'first they came for the far-right' type of situation, that's a bridge we'll have time to think about later.

The normalisation of fascism, the criminalisation of resistance or even of protests, all the way to the boot stomping on your face, all those things appear so fast, too fast to react. So I can see why one would prefer to take the rights of far-right politicians away. If Corbyn came to power and witchhunted Reform, I would think much less of Corbyn but I'd still understand why others would cheer on that.

And when it comes to Palestine Action, they did the kind of violent crimes that I hope will be taught to future generations, same as we taught about resistance in WWII. I and everyone else support Palestine Action not because of the old women, but because they did burglary and vandalism against a terrorist state carrying out genocide. Sunshine and rainbows.

I think they don't know much about history but think they do, and believe that the Crusades were the West heroically coming to help oppressed people because Arabs. 'They started first', basically.

That's a naive understanding of academia.

Meeting standards is nothing but a formality, a form to fill. The PhDs and lab staff doing the killing, if they have any qualms about the act itself or just the purpose of the killing, generally justify it away as being what they have to do to keep the job. The "humane" killing methods are learned on the job through trial and error, and such errors keep happening regularly to experienced staff.

Prior to lockdowns, many/most lab animals just got killed: interesting quality of life standard.

What's written in lab policies is not at all how it happens in reality.

Just wanted to thank you for your posts in this thread. I'm not American, but I feel depressed about the memory-holing that has happened, ever since the last election, where people seemed to.forget that the Democrats presided over the first year of the genocide, and said they would continue doing so if they had won, and have in fact continued facilitating it with whatever power they wield since. Seeing the reactions like the one you got, the Democratic party ascending to sainthood in the eyes of its supporters, from the very start of that election, feels surreal to me.