colinstrickland

Thanks for detailed reply. Yes, the marketing budget for Java was unmatched, but to my eye they were in retreat towards the Enterprise datacentre by 2001. I don't think the Python foundation had launched until 2001. Amazon was migrating off Perl and Oracle. JavaScript only got interesting after Google maps/Wave I think, arguably the second browser wars start when Apple launches Safari, late 2002.

So, I guess the counterfactual line of enquiry ought to be why Perl didn't, or couldn't, or didn't want, to pivot towards stronger commercial backing, sooner.

Do you not think O'Reilly Associates fits some of that role? It seemed like Perl had more commercial backing compared to the other scripting languages if anything at that point. Python and JavaScript were picked up by Google, but later. Amazon was originally built out of Perl. Perl never converted its industry footprint into that kind of advocacy, I think some of that is also culture-driven.

Although Perl auto flattens lists by default, which isn't particularly lisp like.

> Pace and ambition of shipping has not only faded, that very culture is non existent. You don't see people building the next Facebook or Amazon these days, do you?

Do you not? The pace of anthropic/Claude tool development is pretty bonkers, AI hype reminds me of the 90s a lot.

My naive assumption is that WebKit would give a route towards blink and more mainstream compatibility. Gecko was a perfectly defensible choice in the Maemo era, the landscape just moved. That's my point, Jolla sailfish are coupled to old choices and don't have the resource to do much more than keep those maintained.

(Author) Sorry you had a poor experience, yes my blog "engine" is a hacked together POS that barely works, with hand written CSS, that was mostly built before the mobile first era, I have just tweaked it to work somewhat on portrait phone screens, but it's really not a very good website. I do try to generate fairly plain semantic HTML so the pages should work pretty well with "reader mode" or user stylesheets if you have access to that. That's probably the optimal experience.

The platform always suffered from two big architectural missteps.

1 - the native browser being an old firefox/gecko fork embedded into their own UI framework, giving a poor performance and dated compatibility quirks 2 - the android emulating runtime meant that you get again, dated , poorly performing android apps, that you're driven towards because the browser engine was so poor.

these two mean you basically end up with a sub-standard android handset/UI, and a tiny market for native app development (because everyone made do with android), its a real chicken/egg.

In fairness I've not used it since the sony XPeria days, but it was my daily phone for 3-4 years since the Jolla 1. It was cool being able to emacs and irc natively on the phone, but that was limited in use cases tbh.

they did indeed have a crowdfunded tablet that went wrong in supply chain, and basically bankrupted the company. Many funders lost out. That's unfortunate, and perhaps might have been avoidable with better organisation. Absolutely it sucks. They did have a limited refund program as others have noted.

However, they do not have a continous history of not shipping. I personally owned their two previous phone handsets, both shipped. Also I've bought and run their firmwares on third party handsets, they also shipped the software.

I don't remember dselect _downloading_ dependencies, but it may have been capable of resolving the full graph - AFAIK .deb always included dependencies

I think you're right about rpm and yum, actually, my memory failed me. (I was always a Debian user, so didn't have as much direct RedHat experience). I remember yum being really slow when it first arrived too.

(author here) Thanks! Almost all of those lessons are much easier with 30+ years of hindsight and counter-examples, of course.

Yes, I am agreeing with you, whilst adding some detail.

Debian had binary packages with dependencies via dpkg from maybe 1994. Automatic recursive downloads, with apt (apt-get) were much later, around 1998. Rpm was launched in 1997.

It's hard to remember really, but automatic downloads would have been considered quite a misfeature by lots of user sites, in an era of intermittent, metered internet connections.

chunks of Amazon were still in Perl while we were building out IMDb.