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These opinions always pop up during these conversations. I agree spending a ton of money on a degree that isn't going to secure you a well-paying job is not a good idea if you do not want to be in debt for years and years.

However, trades are not a silver bullet and there are many down sides. The pay starts out low, and a lot of the time STAYS low. Trades are notorious for stress injuries. Electrician is ACTUALLY a kind-of dangerous job. You can fry yourself by being careless. As are a lot of the trades.

I would rather have my health, a valuable degree, and body fully working than not have student loan debt.

You can pay off debt and make it go away if you are smart. You cannot heal your shot joints.

SO MANY young people abuse their body thinking it's going to be young forever. It is not.

I always think of it like this:

We already try and make coding as fast and easy as possible. The software industry is not a racket that is hiding some magic tool. If we had a magic bullet that any end-user could use to build their software, we would all be using it already.

Every piece of plastic you have ever encountered still exists somewhere. Think about that. Humans create a STAGGERING amount of trash and we need to stop.

You are being downvoted because nice != fast so it comes off as a bit off topic.

My original comment was pointing out the disparity between a nice car and a nice laptop. Even a 20k car is at least 5x the cost of a top of the line laptop.

Few hundred thousand dollar difference between a nice car and a nice computer.

I've worked with google support before on multiple occasions. For their retail store, fi, and their cloud offering at the $400/mo cloud support contract.

Their support is bad. I would not recommend using any of their products. I would not choose to work there because I cannot imagine it is any better internally.

Ex Chicagoan here. Basically corruption and incompetence took the actual money away

The money did exist. Workers pay into the pensions as part of their compensation package.

Chicago borrowed against the actual pension accounts and corruption/incompetence drained them. Then they did scoop and throw methods for two decades to avoid having the pensions land on their heads.

There is a ton or corruption in Chicago. I have a friend who works for Idot. They have a lot of workers on the payroll who are making 6 figures. My friend has never seen these people who are supposed to be his co-workers show up for work, and when he asked he was told "Don't bring it up. Over your head. We can't fire them."

An non-neutered/spayed dog wouldn't spray on someone's leg? That is false. Dogs tend to be VERY free with their markings.

My partner worked for a non-profit, who apparently traded her name and address to other mailing lists, and it steamrolled out of control. We get PILES of junk mail from various Christian and anti-choice organizations that I find repugnant. It is also just annoying to throw the mail into the recycling and have to deal with the security issues of having piles and piles of mail with our names and addresses on it.

This is our new reality: Constant kafkaesque bullshit that wastes of our time to keep these corporations from sucking our blood.