> I mean, if you want to look at things purely objectively, the last of us was a great game. It made tons of money, got amazing reviews, its recommended and loved by gamers, it frequently appears in lists of the best games ever made, it's won literally hundreds of awards, other game developers have cited it as an influence in their own highly acclaimed works, and it spawned (for better or worse) a media franchise that includes books, comics, television, a stage production, a Universal Studios theme part attraction, a sequel, and a handful of remakes/releases.
Ok, I am going to have to break down why this is just bad argumentation:
- Money argument - By that logic, Call of Duty, FIFA or Madden are the best games of all time. When they clearly are not, as they print cash every year for EA and Activision. That would also mean that the Marvel movies were the best movies ever made. You and I know that is BS.
- Popularity argument - This is the classic argumentum ad populum. Something is not good because it is popular. Good things are often popular, but they are not good because they are popular.
- TV/Movie/whatever adaptations – This is simply milking the franchise for all it is worth. That isn't a good thing.
- Creatively inspired for highly acclaimed works. Often there are many highly acclaimed works in the industry that the players don't like. This happens all the time; something will get a good review score, and the player score will be very different. Look at what is being streamed to see what people actually like.
- Award ceremonies for film, TV and music have always been lampooned for being ridiculous and not a good metric of anything the public cares about. This has been done to death in comedy movies, where they openly lampoon these award ceremonies for what they are. Award ceremonies are simply the industry congratulating itself and a networking/party event.
None of these are good arguments. I am talking about gameplay and replay-ability. TLOU has bad replayability.
> It hits every benchmark except your personal feelings about it. Even as a fan I'd agree that it wasn't without flaws, but none of them were enough to make the game a bad one. The slow movement and scavenging were a part of the game's atmosphere that to many were actually beneficial to the game.
These are not personal feelings. I gave direct examples of where the combat/movement was bad or things that were promised were not delivered in the game.
The presentation of it carries the entire game. It is similar to Uncharted. TLOU is simply Uncharted with a skin.
Contrast that with Spider-Man 1&2, where I skip all the cutscenes for the most part (as the acting and script are terrible); the gameplay is amazing.
Pity I can't skip the cutscenes (consistently) in the Miles Morales standalone DLC/game. The plot and dialogue in that game are dire.
> I, and countless others, have replayed the game and didn't have that issue. It's kind of like going back to movie or book. Some people don't see the point in that either. It's not the best game for replay value. but there are some alternate game options provided and collectables if you missed any in the first run. Players can also experiment with with different weapons/upgrades/tactics. I suspect that most people who go back, go back for the story.
So one of my criticisms was replay-ability. You admit it is a problem. The reason the replayability is bad is because the gameplay is bad.
> Sure, old God of War games. The nudity in those games have been a source of controversy and it's been dialed back. Not that it had any impact on the actual rating thanks to tons of violence but prudish Americans are fine with killing for some reason while drawing the line at boobs. There's no doubt that there will be people who won't or can't play games with a lot of nudity. Personally, I think America should grow up and get over the weird sex hangups, but Corporate America is full of cowards who only care about the bottom line and that doesn't encourage them to to push boundaries.
No, it hasn't been dialled back. It has been removed entirely. The violence has also been dialled back. This was done at the request, I suspect, of Sony. Sony censors almost every games on PlayStation.
> "lack of cleavage" is really not something you can honestly criticize Stellar Blade for, even though some outfits have been changed. They absolutely caved and censored the work from where they started though
They literally dialled it back at the request of Sony.
> I didn't have any issue with the design of Lara for the reboots. She certainly wasn't sexless. (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/cb/Lara_Croft_(2...) and was still attractive
You didn't read what I said. I am talking about how she is treated in the game by the other characters, not that she looks good. I specifically said she looks great.
Ok, I am going to have to break down why this is just bad argumentation:
- Money argument - By that logic, Call of Duty, FIFA or Madden are the best games of all time. When they clearly are not, as they print cash every year for EA and Activision. That would also mean that the Marvel movies were the best movies ever made. You and I know that is BS.
- Popularity argument - This is the classic argumentum ad populum. Something is not good because it is popular. Good things are often popular, but they are not good because they are popular.
- TV/Movie/whatever adaptations – This is simply milking the franchise for all it is worth. That isn't a good thing.
- Creatively inspired for highly acclaimed works. Often there are many highly acclaimed works in the industry that the players don't like. This happens all the time; something will get a good review score, and the player score will be very different. Look at what is being streamed to see what people actually like.
- Award ceremonies for film, TV and music have always been lampooned for being ridiculous and not a good metric of anything the public cares about. This has been done to death in comedy movies, where they openly lampoon these award ceremonies for what they are. Award ceremonies are simply the industry congratulating itself and a networking/party event.
None of these are good arguments. I am talking about gameplay and replay-ability. TLOU has bad replayability.
> It hits every benchmark except your personal feelings about it. Even as a fan I'd agree that it wasn't without flaws, but none of them were enough to make the game a bad one. The slow movement and scavenging were a part of the game's atmosphere that to many were actually beneficial to the game.
These are not personal feelings. I gave direct examples of where the combat/movement was bad or things that were promised were not delivered in the game.
The presentation of it carries the entire game. It is similar to Uncharted. TLOU is simply Uncharted with a skin.
Contrast that with Spider-Man 1&2, where I skip all the cutscenes for the most part (as the acting and script are terrible); the gameplay is amazing.
Pity I can't skip the cutscenes (consistently) in the Miles Morales standalone DLC/game. The plot and dialogue in that game are dire.
> I, and countless others, have replayed the game and didn't have that issue. It's kind of like going back to movie or book. Some people don't see the point in that either. It's not the best game for replay value. but there are some alternate game options provided and collectables if you missed any in the first run. Players can also experiment with with different weapons/upgrades/tactics. I suspect that most people who go back, go back for the story.
So one of my criticisms was replay-ability. You admit it is a problem. The reason the replayability is bad is because the gameplay is bad.
> Sure, old God of War games. The nudity in those games have been a source of controversy and it's been dialed back. Not that it had any impact on the actual rating thanks to tons of violence but prudish Americans are fine with killing for some reason while drawing the line at boobs. There's no doubt that there will be people who won't or can't play games with a lot of nudity. Personally, I think America should grow up and get over the weird sex hangups, but Corporate America is full of cowards who only care about the bottom line and that doesn't encourage them to to push boundaries.
No, it hasn't been dialled back. It has been removed entirely. The violence has also been dialled back. This was done at the request, I suspect, of Sony. Sony censors almost every games on PlayStation.
> "lack of cleavage" is really not something you can honestly criticize Stellar Blade for, even though some outfits have been changed. They absolutely caved and censored the work from where they started though
They literally dialled it back at the request of Sony.
> I didn't have any issue with the design of Lara for the reboots. She certainly wasn't sexless. (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/cb/Lara_Croft_(2...) and was still attractive
You didn't read what I said. I am talking about how she is treated in the game by the other characters, not that she looks good. I specifically said she looks great.