Haven't listened to this one yet but for people with sticker shock over the time commitment, Lex consistently does amazing podcasts with really sharp people over the course of a few hours and imo (being an avid podcast listener) it's one of the best out there.
Edit to add: His recent episode with Jack Barsky (former KGB spy) was exceptional and worth a listen if 5hrs is too long of a test case
Edit to add: His recent episode with Jack Barsky (former KGB spy) was exceptional and worth a listen if 5hrs is too long of a test case